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torque02 Offline
#1 Posted: Wed, May 26 2004, 9:34 AM EST
Joined: 05-20-2004
Posts: 19
My first post so here it goes.

I have done some checking on past boards and some thread searches and come up wanting. I am new to wonderful world of cigar smoking(thanks to my brother-in-laws Xmas gift)and I am tring to find out what seperates a great cigar from a premium or super premium. I know taste is subjective, one persons rocket is anothers daily go to. Is it strictly price deal?

Torque
Robby Offline
#2 Posted: Wed, May 26 2004, 10:06 AM EST
Joined: 10-30-2002
Posts: 5,067
Usually. i.e., you won't get any arguments about PAM being a super premium (Padron Anniversary Maduro) but they're pricey. However, there are others that are close and well loved, i.e., I really like the Torano Tributes, they also are not cheap, but less than the PAMs.
hensed Offline
#3 Posted: Wed, May 26 2004, 10:21 AM EST
Joined: 07-16-2003
Posts: 1,268
That is really a tough question to quantify. Yes most of the premium super premium debate does revolve around the price tag of a cigar. But it also includes other things such as availability, ingredients and manufacture.

As a new guy don't get to hung up on seeking out the premium stuff right away because for the most part your palette won't be ready for the more complex blends and stronger flavors you will generally find in premium cigars. The hobby of smoking cigars is mostly about the journey of discovery. We all start out that way and as we grow in this hobby (read obsessed) we cultivate our tastes that will change over time. It’s real easy to walk into a shop and order the most expensive thing they have and think you’re an experienced smoker cause your smoking the good stuff. Half the fun of this is finding that lil gem of a stick that costs hardly anything, you will cherish those experiences.
Deriffe Offline
#4 Posted: Wed, May 26 2004, 10:22 AM EST
Joined: 06-30-2003
Posts: 522
In my mind, it has a lot to do with the price of the cigars. Some rare Dunhills, Opus X, etc. that are very high end limited editions and are very expensive are what I consider super premiums. There are a ton of what could be considered premiums.
torque02 Offline
#5 Posted: Wed, May 26 2004, 10:26 AM EST
Joined: 05-20-2004
Posts: 19
I agree, I have had one PAM and it was wonderful. I just need to figure out how to get few to stash without the wife having a bird. I have also had alot of the CAO line. The Criollo and Brazilia are my current fav. Would CAO be a prem or just a dang good smoke? That is where my confusion lies.
torque02 Offline
#6 Posted: Wed, May 26 2004, 10:33 AM EST
Joined: 05-20-2004
Posts: 19
I have gone through a few of the cheaper smokes looking for that great find for the money. I have found 2. But the search always continues. One of the problems that I have is the local shops. I am in Minneapolis and there are a few good shops around. But most of them carry the same stuff. Punch, Hoyo, Fuente, etc. There is nothing wrong with those. But Variety is the spice. Thank god for CI and Cbid.
bassdude Offline
#7 Posted: Wed, May 26 2004, 10:37 AM EST
Joined: 01-13-2004
Posts: 8,871
I would consider most CAOs to be premium smokes, except for the flavors.
penzt8 Offline
#8 Posted: Wed, May 26 2004, 11:34 AM EST
Joined: 06-05-2000
Posts: 1,771
I was going to give a long winded response with a definition of the word PREMIUM and examples of premium and super premium cigars but after typing the 12 paragraphs, I decided against it. Essentially it's a matter of cost of the cigar in relation to the quality and availability. Every expensive cigar isn't a premium/super premium. Every inexpensive cigar isn't a dog rocket.
MACS Offline
#9 Posted: Wed, May 26 2004, 12:48 PM EST
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,833
To me, a premium is a good tasting smoke. A super premium is a GREAT tasting smoke.

Great tasting smokes that are also hard to find or rare are called EL's (edicion limitada).

But what the hell do I know? This is just my humble opinion...
dbguru Offline
#10 Posted: Wed, May 26 2004, 1:21 PM EST
Joined: 03-06-2002
Posts: 1,300
Good topic and thancks for posting Tourque!! Please don't hesitate to chime in to the chat...

To meprice does have a lot to do with the premium/super-premium classification. Beyond that, things get pretty subjective. I would classify the threshold price for premiums at roughly $3.00 minimum and super premiums at roughly 10.00 minimum. Occassionally you get deals and there may be premiums available at 5-8 dollars that you would enjoy as much as a 12 dollar super-premium but that is the subjective end of this topic... Based on box prices over the web or auction prices, $3 and $10 seem to be consistent thresholds.

rayder1 Offline
#11 Posted: Wed, May 26 2004, 2:22 PM EST
Joined: 06-02-2002
Posts: 2,226
Torque2.... you're pretty much heading in the right direction just by checking out this board.
Look back a the posts for the last year or so, and you will see several brands that frequently pop up with positive reviews.

Those are some of the one's to try. (5 packs are the rule for many here). Yeah...it's pretty cool to show up at a poker party and light up a Montecristo. Might even impress a few who know what one is. The theme of cigarbid is variety.

There's always something to try and Cbid does a great job in breaking open the cigar boxes and selling 5 packs and samplers. If you search back through the posts here, you will get a few good ideas.

Many of the cheapies you can get here will kick a** on many of the self proclaimed "Super Premium's".
Anyway...a lot of good cigars you can get here don't even have bands...so if some cigar snob asks...just tell him its "Cuban".
CWFoster Offline
#12 Posted: Wed, May 26 2004, 5:55 PM EST
Joined: 12-12-2003
Posts: 5,414
I got into this debate once before and got chewed on pretty good by at least one of the FOG's (course, I'm pretty much an FOG myself!and as such, feel the right to be opinionated! LOL) I think that to yourself, it's really a subjective thing, but when you get to trading, and swapping cigars, you have to have a yardstick that everybody can agree on, To wit: if sombody thinks that the very DEFINITION of premium is their second favorite cigar, Bad Frogs, and the best SUPER PREMIUM is a Lone Wolf, and say gifted Penzt8 with a generous bomb of their favorites, they may be dissappointed at the level of gratitude expressed. Some on here may think Opus X's are overrated, but would never fail to express gratitude and appreciation at receiving such an expensive and hard to get cigar. I have had PAM's and they ARE great! But I like La Aurora Preferidos better! Same price range, unless you get into the Tubos then the Preferidos go through the roof! At $17.50 ea. at my local, I know if I send someone a red perfecto shaped tube in a package of gars, I'm going to get attention! :) But like Hensed told you, the REAL fun of this hobby is finding those two dollar cigars that fit your flavor profile to a tee! At the risk of temporarily driving the bidding up on them, try the Free Cubas sometime! They can be had for around a buck apiece! not bad at all! Same can be said for the Sacubas! (milder though) When I'm gifting cigars to someone, or trading, I like to establish what I'm going to send, and then add a few less than premium sticks that I think they may enjoy! If someone gifts me, I like seeing the old favorites, but a jewel that I can afford to buy a box of without taking out a loan is a good thing too! :) Have fun with it! there's no other reason to be here!
Da-Glyde Offline
#13 Posted: Wed, May 26 2004, 6:37 PM EST
Joined: 10-25-2003
Posts: 892
.....to each is his own..

GIG'EM,
torque02 Offline
#14 Posted: Thu, May 27 2004, 4:12 AM EST
Joined: 05-20-2004
Posts: 19
Thanks for all the info folks. CW you touched on why I had started this thread in the first place. Hopefully soon I will be in a position where I can get in on some trading. And being a newbie I want to make sure I do right by other people. First impressions ya know.
rayder1 Offline
#15 Posted: Thu, May 27 2004, 9:55 AM EST
Joined: 06-02-2002
Posts: 2,226
Torque...
buy that 5Vegas Assortment pack on sale now (if you haven't already tried them).

La10870 Offline
#16 Posted: Thu, May 27 2004, 10:07 AM EST
Joined: 10-14-1999
Posts: 993
I agree with everything CWFoster says above. I try and buy a 5-pack of just about every cigar on CBID, just as I pick up 2 of every new cigar I see at various shops. (within my $$$). I was on vacation last week and took a number of my most expensive smokes since I would have time on the beach to enjoy. I smoked 3 super-super premiums one day ($20+) and 2 of them were so good I felt like I was drinking the cigar. The other was "okay". I also smoked some premiums ??? that I paid between $1-3 each for on CBID and they held up pretty damn well against the big boys.

Anyway, enjoy the addiction...this is a great place to be and check the trade boards and birthday clubs for variety.



torque02 Offline
#17 Posted: Thu, May 27 2004, 10:10 AM EST
Joined: 05-20-2004
Posts: 19
Rayder1

Those are the next smokes I want to try. They are in the top 10 of the list of smokes I want to try yet.
Palama Offline
#18 Posted: Mon, Jan 2 2023, 2:24 PM EST
Joined: 02-05-2013
Posts: 23,735
Good topic for the newbs.
Sunoverbeach Offline
#19 Posted: Mon, Jan 2 2023, 2:28 PM EST
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 14,675
I'm just happy to see the Brazilia made it into the conversation
Mraia Offline
#20 Posted: Mon, Jan 2 2023, 2:52 PM EST
Joined: 04-18-2019
Posts: 427
This forum has turned me onto some great smokes. My Father Le Bijou 1922, New World Maduro, Plascencias, Man o Wars, Cohibas, Rocky Patel Decade, Olivia series V Melanio, etc. I won’t really pay more than $12-$15 for a stick and that’s really pushing it!
Hang around here, check your ego at the door and soak up some of the great ideas, knowledge, and banter. You won’t regret it!!
Palama Offline
#21 Posted: Mon, Jan 2 2023, 3:10 PM EST
Joined: 02-05-2013
Posts: 23,735
Mraia wrote:
This forum has turned me onto some great smokes. My Father Le Bijou 1922, New World Maduro, Plascencias, Man o Wars, Cohibas, Rocky Patel Decade, Olivia series V Melanio, etc. I won’t really pay more than $12-$15 for a stick and that’s really pushing it!
Hang around here, check your ego at the door and soak up some of the great ideas, knowledge, and banter. You won’t regret it!!


Haha! I remember when you DIDN’T think much of this site (…or was it because of a particular braddah?…).

Glad you stuck it out! ThumpUp
corey sellers Offline
#22 Posted: Mon, Jan 2 2023, 3:39 PM EST
Joined: 08-21-2011
Posts: 10,366
I will get you some smokes other than those and some aged smokes out this week some time.
tonygraz Offline
#23 Posted: Mon, Jan 2 2023, 5:17 PM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,288
I like the Brazilia Gol, but don't smoke them often. Sometimes they are good and other times they are not so good. It's about the only CAO in the line that I'll buy and then only when the price is right.
To me premium is expensive and super premium is way too expensive. I'm satisfied smoking a lot of different yard cigars and when I find something really good at a good price, I'm a buyer. Everybody has a different palate and cigars liked by the majority are usually the ones I like. I like most of the Oliva line - particularly the more expensive ones.
corey sellers Offline
#24 Posted: Mon, Jan 2 2023, 5:50 PM EST
Joined: 08-21-2011
Posts: 10,366
I try not to go over 10 per cigar. But it happens occasionally. I buy boxes when I buy and it's usually limited edition stuff. Some of this stuff does taste the same . Think I need a break from smokes .

But phug that
Mraia Offline
#25 Posted: Mon, Jan 2 2023, 6:17 PM EST
Joined: 04-18-2019
Posts: 427
Lol well this is a tough group to crack into! I mean, there is a LOT to know and a lot of opinions…but man it’s fun and informative!
corey sellers Offline
#26 Posted: Mon, Jan 2 2023, 6:21 PM EST
Joined: 08-21-2011
Posts: 10,366
Yeah , There is alot of great botl here. STAY AWAY FROM POLITICS. PEOPLE WANT TO FIGHT OVER THERE.

JUST SAYIN...

LOVE YOU SHAWN
corey sellers Offline
#27 Posted: Mon, Jan 2 2023, 6:23 PM EST
Joined: 08-21-2011
Posts: 10,366
One thing you need to remember and this is the most important thing on this forum.

CELTICBOMBER IS THE BEST CUSTOMER SERVICE GUY THEY HAVE.
Mraia Offline
#28 Posted: Tue, Jan 3 2023, 3:35 PM EST
Joined: 04-18-2019
Posts: 427
🤣🤣🤣🤣
cashmoneydave Offline
#29 Posted: Fri, Jan 6 2023, 4:34 PM EST
Joined: 08-16-2018
Posts: 805
I like it when the manufacturer just tells me their cigar is a super premium. I mean to exceed premium would mean super premium right?

From Oliva’s website,

“ Serie V Melanio is hand rolled using expertly fermented ligero fillers, these leaves are known for their robust and rich flavor. This special cigar is sure to exceed a premium cigar smoker’s highest expectations. “
LeeBot Online
#30 Posted: Fri, Jan 6 2023, 5:44 PM EST
Joined: 07-08-2020
Posts: 2,028
Ezra Zion, which I like a lot (don't get me wrong), has the super-duperest most premium-ist cigars of anyone. Just read their write ups.

I went to their website and looked at the first thing on the cigar page - Hot Caramel Sunday Ltd. It's a brand new release. Among other things:

HOT CARAMEL SUNDAE Ltd. is intensely delicious! The creaminess and “caramel-ness” are going to leave you begging for more!
HOT CARAMEL SUNDAE Ltd. will be SOLD OUT extremely fast!

Just take it from them. It's that good.

The next one on the list, All My Ex's - The Lost Blend

This cigar is *literally* a miracle! ...
In fact, the members of our “super-secret” tasting panel have all told us that ALL MY EX’S The Lost Blend is one of the best cigars they have ever smoked! (Some of them have been smoking for several decades and never had a cigar like it!)


Etc., etc., etc. Everything they make is slap-yo-mama-in-the-mouth, too-good-to-believe, too-amazing-not-to-buy, get-them-while-they're-still-here, great!
Jakethesnake86 Offline
#31 Posted: Fri, Jan 6 2023, 7:20 PM EST
Joined: 12-29-2020
Posts: 4,202
Yeah I like ez but not as much as some. The hype is too much for me. They’re good smokes but never have I smoked one and thought that’s the best cigar I’ve ever had. But I do like em
cashmoneydave Offline
#32 Posted: Tue, Jan 10 2023, 9:34 AM EST
Joined: 08-16-2018
Posts: 805
Wow I haven’t seen that much not so subtle hype from any other cigar brand. Crazy!
delta1 Offline
#33 Posted: Tue, Jan 10 2023, 2:06 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,814
Sunoverbeach wrote:
I'm just happy to see the Brazilia made it into the conversation



dayum...I didn't know that it has been a top fave for nearly two decades...thought it was just a few years...
delta1 Offline
#34 Posted: Tue, Jan 10 2023, 2:22 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,814
cashmoneydave wrote:
Wow I haven’t seen that much not so subtle hype from any other cigar brand. Crazy!




I got sucked into the EZ hype a few years ago and decided to try two 10 cigar samplers...they were OK...hard to distinguish one from another...I didn't think they were super premiums nor worth their price...

there are a lot of opinions about super premium labels...most by the manufacturers trying to convince folks their cigars are worth the price...I've smoked cigars that are labeled/priced "premium" and "super premium"...

some premiums were very good to excellent and better than some super premiums and vice versa...

and others with both labels that were not very good.

But we have used those labels here, to try to establish fairness in trades, and usually it's tied to the price of a cigar... yard gars or rockets often are $10 (IMO - YMMV)

the range for premium and super premium have risen during the last couple of years...
cashmoneydave Offline
#35 Posted: Tue, Jan 10 2023, 9:51 PM EST
Joined: 08-16-2018
Posts: 805
It took me a long time to figure out what premium and super premiums were on this forum. A few of trades some people showing me what they would send and some guys appreciating what I sent. I’ve seen some argue its not the price…but I know what you mean, with all the price increases I get what you mean about hard to find anything good under $10 anymore. Also respect being able to find some single or fivers here that I can age for fairly cheap comparable to MSRP or over prices most other places. Then there’s the challenge of what I like and think is premium someone else doesn’t like. Then there’s the challenge of spending more and more money every year on cigar ha ha. Now I find myself trying to figure out if all these super limited are also super premium ha ha!!!
delta1 Offline
#36 Posted: Wed, Jan 11 2023, 2:35 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,814
for some reason, my post got altered and I can't correct it: has to do with prices

yardgars, everydays and rockets are <$4-$5; premiums are>$6 and <$10; super premiums are >$10... and these are not MSRP of cigars that sell at deep discounts, like Gurkhas

IMHO/YMMV
corey sellers Offline
#37 Posted: Wed, Jan 11 2023, 4:43 PM EST
Joined: 08-21-2011
Posts: 10,366
I agree with this ^^^
cashmoneydave Offline
#38 Posted: Thu, Jan 12 2023, 3:46 PM EST
Joined: 08-16-2018
Posts: 805
LeeBot wrote:
Ezra Zion, which I like a lot (don't get me wrong), has the super-duperest most premium-ist cigars of anyone. Just read their write ups.

I went to their website and looked at the first thing on the cigar page - Hot Caramel Sunday Ltd. It's a brand new release. Among other things:

HOT CARAMEL SUNDAE Ltd. is intensely delicious! The creaminess and “caramel-ness” are going to leave you begging for more!
HOT CARAMEL SUNDAE Ltd. will be SOLD OUT extremely fast!

Just take it from them. It's that good.

The next one on the list, All My Ex's - The Lost Blend

This cigar is *literally* a miracle! ...
In fact, the members of our “super-secret” tasting panel have all told us that ALL MY EX’S The Lost Blend is one of the best cigars they have ever smoked! (Some of them have been smoking for several decades and never had a cigar like it!)


Etc., etc., etc. Everything they make is slap-yo-mama-in-the-mouth, too-good-to-believe, too-amazing-not-to-buy, get-them-while-they're-still-here, great!


You left out the part about Oreo cookie. Man I must not have a refined enough palate ha ha….
“ As it progresses, notes of Oreo cookies, powdered sugar, white oak wood, and macadamia nuts. The blend grows even more complex with hints of heavy cream and cocoa powder.”
Sunoverbeach Offline
#39 Posted: Thu, Jan 12 2023, 7:27 PM EST
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 14,675
Curious how fast they'd sell out if they rolled more than a couple hundred of them
tonygraz Offline
#40 Posted: Thu, Jan 12 2023, 7:37 PM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,288
Just saw a cigar called ultra-premium - they must be un-affordable.
Jakethesnake86 Offline
#41 Posted: Fri, Jan 13 2023, 12:43 AM EST
Joined: 12-29-2020
Posts: 4,202
@sunover fair…. I don’t mind spending on a cigar I love. Like love. Padron 64-26. Love em. That’s cool once in a while. But if I’m paying over 10$ I’ve been disappointed more often than not. Just curious who decides what that cigar is worth.

Watching YouTube the other day saw an ad for “crooked crown “ cigars. Love to try one but immediately they’re 10$ a pop. Rolled by oliva with a Cameroon wrap. So is it just the g with a fun band? I really like the g. But I’m not giving 10.


How do you know
delta1 Offline
#42 Posted: Fri, Jan 13 2023, 5:38 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,814
the latest disappointing cigar that I smoked that was proclaimed a super premium was a Highclere Castle...think it was $12...not even close to a super premium...I remembered thinking that a Buenaventura Crema C100 that DED sent as a low-end smoke in a blind taste test review was better

there have been plenty of other $10-$15 cigars billed as super premiums (cough Davidoff cough) that I've tried and was disappointed that I spent so much on them...


like Jake said, Padron 26/64 deserve that status...Fuente Anejo and Don Carlos...Tatuaje Cojonu, Le Verite... Ashton VSG...LGD Small Batch...Eiroa First 20 years Colorado...a few others...



what are some cigars in the $10 plus range have you thought were worthy?
Jakethesnake86 Offline
#43 Posted: Fri, Jan 13 2023, 7:10 PM EST
Joined: 12-29-2020
Posts: 4,202
Illusione of
Epernay
And warped eagles descent were two recent let downs.
Jakethesnake86 Offline
#44 Posted: Fri, Jan 13 2023, 11:59 PM EST
Joined: 12-29-2020
Posts: 4,202
One I buy over 10 I really like that cojuno 2012
Jakethesnake86 Offline
#45 Posted: Sat, Jan 14 2023, 12:00 AM EST
Joined: 12-29-2020
Posts: 4,202
Sumatra specifically ^^
tonygraz Offline
#46 Posted: Sat, Jan 14 2023, 7:55 AM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,288
Never spent more that $ 7 on a cigar (maybe $8 once) - almost always a disappointment.
Huzza3045 Offline
#47 Posted: Sat, Jan 14 2023, 2:20 PM EST
Joined: 11-07-2022
Posts: 570
Bought a Sombremesa Brûlée for 12. Worth every penny :)
Palama Offline
#48 Posted: Sat, Jan 14 2023, 6:08 PM EST
Joined: 02-05-2013
Posts: 23,735
Huzza3045 wrote:
Bought a Sombremesa Brûlée for 12. Worth every penny :)


I wish they were offered in a wider range of vitolas and smaller RG. Corona, CG and Lonsdale would be the vitolas I would love to see added to the line. But, then again, mebbe those sizes don’t translate well so that’s why they’re not available.
Jakethesnake86 Offline
#49 Posted: Sat, Jan 14 2023, 6:53 PM EST
Joined: 12-29-2020
Posts: 4,202
I was guessing the same^. I do like that smoke though. Seems some smokes only work in some sizes.
The robusto doesn’t put me off at all.
Sunoverbeach Offline
#50 Posted: Sat, Jan 14 2023, 7:41 PM EST
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 14,675
Jake smoked a robusto ? Are you drunk again?

Related side note: my phone now autocorrects robusto to romusto. So, you can add that to your life achievements
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