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January 6 Memorial Holiday
HockeyDad Offline
#1 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,163
Anybody doing anything special for the upcoming holiday?
Palama Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 02-05-2013
Posts: 23,729
HockeyDad wrote:
Anybody doing anything special for the upcoming holiday?


It’s also AJ Hawk’s birthday but haven’t, yet, received my invitation to his party. Gonz
RayR Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 8,927
HD...Are you talking about memorializing that FAKE January 6, 2021 INSURRECTION DAY? No way MAN!

I'm celebrating Jan, 6, 1861 INSURRECTION DAY when Florida troops seized the Federal arsenal at Apalachicola and NYC mayor Fernando Wood first proposed that NYC succeed from the Union.

ZRX1200 Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
I’m going to reinvest my blackrock/vanguard gains.

Then I’m going to send 10% to the big guy.
drglnc Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 04-01-2019
Posts: 715
i will spend my day on the 6th encouraging others to get out and vote when the time comes... followed by a nice session of laughing at people like Henry Tarrio who gave up 22 years (in his case) of life because he believed trump and his clans lies about a "stolen" election...
MACS Offline
#6 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,823
drglnc wrote:
i will spend my day on the 6th encouraging others to get out and vote when the time comes... followed by a nice session of laughing at people like Henry Tarrio who gave up 22 years (in his case) of life because he believed trump and his clans lies about a "stolen" election...


Trump won every swing state with the "in person" voting. Biden won every swing state when the "mail in" was tabulated. The odds of that are astronomical, but you go ahead and believe that 81 million people voted for the demented pedo in chief.
drglnc Offline
#7 Posted:
Joined: 04-01-2019
Posts: 715
MACS wrote:
Trump won every swing state with the "in person" voting. Biden won every swing state when the "mail in" was tabulated. The odds of that are astronomical, but you go ahead and believe that 81 million people voted for the demented pedo in chief.


until someone proves otherwise... i will continue to believe Biden won that election fairly... considering the right championed in person voting while the left pushed mail in voting it is not surprising in the least that the votes were broken down that way... still waiting for rudy and trump to produce all that "evidence" they have promised for 3 years though...

as far as the pedo comment that i shouldn't even bother to acknowledge... Trump and Biden... Only one of them was named in the Epstein docs... Pretty sure only one of them referred to Epstein as a "terrific guy" as well... just sayin...
RayR Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 8,927
We now know how PEDO JOE, (fresh off his Caribbean vacation, the highlight of which was getting brain freeze from eating lots of chocolate chip ice cream) has memorialized Jan. 6th. In front of a hand-picked audience of clapping seals, he says that he knows what was in George Washington's BONES. He says those Valley Forge insurrectionists were fighting for DUHMACRACY. What a moron!
I'd like to know who this brain trust of propagandist historians and scholars was who wrote his speech.
Well, the bulk of the sermon was seething vitriol, and a bunch of partisan BS about Trump, lies about protecting the Constitution and DUHMACRACY! . DUHMACRACY!, DUHMACRACY! I lost count of how many times he uttered that word. A true demagogue he is.


Watch Live: President Biden Marks Jan-6 Anniversary (By Calling Trump A Threat To Democracy & Freedom)

by Tyler Durden
Friday, Jan 05, 2024 - 03:05 PM

Quote:
President Biden's first major campaign event of 2024 is set to take place in the key battleground state of Pennsylvania. The president intends to persuade the American people - in a speech - that former President Trump, his most likely presidential election opponent, is a threat to democracy.

Biden is expected to speak at Montgomery County Community College, about 15 miles from the Revolutionary War encampment of Valley Forge, on Friday afternoon, one day before the third anniversary of the January 6 Capitol riot.

Biden's aides told Reuters that the speech's theme will be about "preserving democracy."

Another aide told ABC News Chief White House Correspondent Mary Bruce that the president worked very hard crafting his speech after meeting with historians and scholars at the White House this week.

The president is expected to call Trump and MAGA Americans 'far-right extremists' and a genuine threat to the freedoms on which the country was founded.

The Biden-Harris campaign said Montgomery County Community College is a "stone's throw" away from the Revolutionary War encampment of Valley Forge. This is where then-General George Washington, leading the Continental Army, "transformed a disorganized alliance of colonial militias into a cohesive coalition united in their fight for our democracy" 250 years ago.

More...

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/watch-live-biden-marks-jan-6-anniversary-calling-trump-threat-democracy-freedom

RiverRatRuss Offline
#9 Posted:
Joined: 09-02-2022
Posts: 1,035
OHHHHHHHHHHHH This One is Commical as Fugg!!!!
HockeyDad Offline
#10 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,163
Happy failed insurrection day!
RobertHively Offline
#11 Posted:
Joined: 01-14-2015
Posts: 1,893
^

"It was just like Pearl Harbor"
RayR Offline
#12 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 8,927
RobertHively wrote:
^

"It was just like Pearl Harbor"


It was even worse than Pearl Harbor, A date which will live in infamy
Worse than 9/11
Even worse than the Civil War when the Confederates invaded...um, no, that's not what happened
It was an uprising, an insurrection by a ruthless, armed mob of election deniers.
It was a coup d’etat, a sudden, violent seizure of power involving clandestine plots.
It was a revolution more bloody than The French Revolution

So I've been told.
MACS Offline
#13 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,823
drglnc wrote:
until someone proves otherwise... i will continue to believe Biden won that election fairly... considering the right championed in person voting while the left pushed mail in voting it is not surprising in the least that the votes were broken down that way... still waiting for rudy and trump to produce all that "evidence" they have promised for 3 years though...

as far as the pedo comment that i shouldn't even bother to acknowledge... Trump and Biden... Only one of them was named in the Epstein docs... Pretty sure only one of them referred to Epstein as a "terrific guy" as well... just sayin...


Only one of them banned him from Mar-a-Lago and reported him to the cops, too... might want to get your facts straight, but that'd be something new.
DrafterX Offline
#14 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,560
He prolly gets his news from the View.... Mellow
RayR Offline
#15 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 8,927
DrafterX wrote:
He prolly gets his news from the View.... Mellow


He loves those shrieking harpies. 👹👹👹👹
8trackdisco Offline
#16 Posted:
Joined: 11-06-2004
Posts: 60,090
What exactly are the best Insurrection Day presents to give?

Shattered glassware?
Pitchforks and Sticks?
Official Mike Pence Rope?

Maybe the could ask the Floundering Fathers who celebrated the first one.

Many of them are a Captive Audience of people who listened to the wrong Influencer: The Other Big Guy.
DrafterX Offline
#17 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,560
The Insurrection Barbie playset... Mellow
drglnc Offline
#18 Posted:
Joined: 04-01-2019
Posts: 715
Yea… I heard Trump was mad that his party partner and buddy ep was beating him out on a real estate deal and had already stolen his underage girl friend so he made an anonymous call… then later called him a Terrific guy cause that’s what you do…
DrafterX Offline
#19 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,560
'Well, I knew him like everybody in Palm Beach knew him. I mean, people in Palm Beach knew him. He was a fixture in Palm Beach. I had a falling out with him a long time ago. I don't think I've spoken to him for 15 years. I wasn't a fan. I was not, yeah, a long time ago, I'd say maybe 15 years. I was not a fan of his, that I can tell you. I was not a fan of his.'

Clinton is who you should be worried about... I bet they don't talk about him on the View...Mellow
Mr. Jones Offline
#20 Posted:
Joined: 06-12-2005
Posts: 19,443
Yes,
I went searching for unchecked scratch off tickets...

$2
$6
$10
$40

FIDDY EIGHT SMACKA's
DrafterX Offline
#21 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,560
Mellow
Whistlebritches Offline
#22 Posted:
Joined: 04-23-2006
Posts: 22,128
MACS wrote:
Only one of them banned him from Mar-a-Lago and reported him to the cops, too... might want to get your facts straight, but that'd be something new.



Facts...........come on Shawn your talking to drglnc, he gets all his news from trusted sources like PMSNBC.I even heard Rachel Maddow gives him wood.
drglnc Offline
#23 Posted:
Joined: 04-01-2019
Posts: 715
You guys think the drug dealers a good guy cause he turns in his supplier huh?
DrafterX Offline
#24 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,560
Mellow
Whistlebritches Offline
#25 Posted:
Joined: 04-23-2006
Posts: 22,128
drglnc wrote:
You guys think the drug dealers a good guy cause he turns in his supplier huh?



More liberal gibberish!!!
MACS Offline
#26 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,823
8trackdisco wrote:
What exactly are the best Insurrection Day presents to give?

Shattered glassware?
Pitchforks and Sticks?
Official Mike Pence Rope?

Maybe the could ask the Floundering Fathers who celebrated the first one.

Many of them are a Captive Audience of people who listened to the wrong Influencer: The Other Big Guy.


It's best to give out what many of the ne'er do wells were carrying that day... American Flags and pocket constitutions. Or maybe a camera if you want to get spendy.

You heard that right. Folks tried to take over the capitol with no weapons. What. So. Ever.
rfenst Offline
#27 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,360
MACS wrote:
It's best to give out what many of the ne'er do wells were carrying that day... American Flags and pocket constitutions. Or maybe a camera if you want to get spendy.

You heard that right. Folks tried to take over the capitol with no weapons. What. So. Ever.

So, "no weapons" is your litmus test on the entire matter?
drglnc Offline
#28 Posted:
Joined: 04-01-2019
Posts: 715
Can’t stop lying huh? Very trump of you… federal charges against rioters shows they were armed with stun guns, pepper spray, bear spray, baseball bats and flagpoles wielded and swung as clubs to name a few…
HockeyDad Offline
#29 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,163
rfenst wrote:
So, "no weapons" is your litmus test on the entire matter?


It’s a pretty good litmus test to determine whether it is an insurrection or a mostly peaceful protest.
HockeyDad Offline
#30 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,163
drglnc wrote:
Can’t stop lying huh? Very trump of you… federal charges against rioters shows they were armed with stun guns, pepper spray, bear spray, baseball bats and flagpoles wielded and swung as clubs to name a few…


Those were prolly the FBI guys.
rfenst Offline
#31 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,360
HockeyDad wrote:
It’s a pretty good litmus test to determine whether it is an insurrection or a mostly peaceful protest.

It very well may have been a peaceful protest by most at the capital, but in totality it was not.
What's your definition of "insurrection"?
MACS Offline
#32 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,823
HockeyDad wrote:
It’s a pretty good litmus test to determine whether it is an insurrection or a mostly peaceful protest.

HockeyDad wrote:
Those were prolly the FBI guys.


Some folks are still convinced it wasn't 100% staged. Same folks that were okay with Congress not releasing ALL the tapes. Same folks who likely haven't bothered to watch any of the released tapes that show what a fkn sham the whole thing was.

*shrug*

Folks rather believe the lies than admit they were lied to and fell for it.
HockeyDad Offline
#33 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,163
Insurrection definitions are numerous.

A rising against civil or political authority. (This one can be used to cover any protest)

An act or instance of revolting against civil authority or an established government.

The act or an instance of revolting especially violently against civil or political authority or against an established government.

Armed rebellion.

An uprising against a larger force that's in power.

The act or an instance of revolting especially violently against civil or political authority or against an established government.

The most recent definition: Registering to vote as a Republican.



I like armed rebellion as the definition because the others are all broad enough to allow the government to literally kill any opposition.


Brewha Offline
#34 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,201
Over 1,200 people brought up on federal charges, over 460 people in jail - so far.

So pretty much an insurrection. Unless you are one of those that wanted to participate….
Brewha Offline
#35 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,201
DrafterX wrote:
The Insurrection Barbie playset... Mellow

My wife is gonna want one of those……
Mr. Jones Offline
#36 Posted:
Joined: 06-12-2005
Posts: 19,443
That mob Was filled with FBI AGENTS
AND PROLLY A FEW SSG DIVISION MORONS DRESSED LIKE LIBRARIANS AND PROUD BOYS...Gary O'Conner was the guy who planted all the pipe bombs aLLedGeDly...
RayR Offline
#37 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 8,927
True HD

The words "insurrection" and "insurrectionist" have been reduced to being meaningless words
It's just like Orwell wrote about the word Fascism, The word insurrection has now no meaning except in so far as it signifies ‘something not desirable. It's a political word that is used to denigrate somebody you don't like. So even petitioning the government for a redress of grievances can lead one to be accused of insurrection against democracy (which is another meaningless word. See Joe Biden)
The same people on the left who would accuse some people of being insurrectionists are the same people who would describe violent acts of wanton destruction of property by leftist mobs like burning down cities as mostly peaceful protesting.
rfenst Offline
#38 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,360
HockeyDad wrote:
Insurrection definitions are numerous.
A rising against civil or political authority. (This one can be used to cover any protest)
An act or instance of revolting against civil authority or an established government.
The act or an instance of revolting especially violently against civil or political authority or against an established government.
Armed rebellion.
An uprising against a larger force that's in power.
The act or an instance of revolting especially violently against civil or political authority or against an established government.
The most recent definition: Registering to vote as a Republican.

I like armed rebellion as the definition because the others are all broad enough to allow the government to literally kill any opposition.



.
2. “Insurrection”

¶179 Dictionaries (both old and new), the district court’s order, and the briefing
by the parties and the amici curiae suggest several definitions of the word
“insurrection.”

¶180 For example, Noah Webster’s dictionary from 1860 defined “insurrection”
as:

A rising against civil or political authority; the open and active
opposition of a number of persons to the execution of law in a city or
state. It is equivalent to SEDITION, except that sedition expresses a
less extensive rising of citizens. It differs from REBELLION, for the
latter expresses a revolt, or an attempt to overthrow the government,
to establish a different one, or to place the country under another
jurisdiction.

Noah Webster, An American Dictionary of the English Language 613 (1860);
accord John Bouvier, A Law Dictionary Adapted to the Constitution and Laws of
the United States of America and of the Several States to the American Union
(6th ed. 1856), available at https://wzukusers.storage.googleapis.com/user32960741/documents/5ad525c314331myoR8FY/1856_bouvier_6.pdf [https://perma.cc/PXK4-M75N] (defining “insurrection” as “[a] rebellion of citizens ors ubjects of a country against its government”).

¶181 Third New International Dictionary defines “insurrection” as “an
act or instance of revolting against civil or political authority or against an
established government” or “an act or instance of rising up physically.”
Insurrection, Webster’s Third New International Dictionary (2002)
.

¶182 In light of these and other proffered definitions, the district court concluded
that “an insurrection as used in Section Three is (1) a public use of force or threat
of force (2) by a group of people (3) to hinder or prevent execution of the
Constitution of the United States.” Anderson, ¶ 240.

¶183 Finally, we note that at oral argument, President Trump’s counsel, while not
providing a specific definition, argued that an insurrection is more than a riot but
less than a rebellion. We agree that an insurrection falls along a spectrum of
related conduct.
See The Brig Amy Warwick (The Prize Cases), 67 U.S. (2 Black) 635,
666 (1862) (“Insurrection against a government may or may not culminate in an
organized rebellion, but a civil war always begins by insurrection against the
lawful authority of the Government.”)
; Case of Davis, 7 F. Cas. 63, 96 (C.C.D. Va.
1871) (No. 3,621a) (“Although treason by levying war, in a case of civil war, may
involve insurrection or rebellion, and they are usually its first stages, they do not
necessarily reach to the actual levying of war.”)
; 77 C.J.S. Riot; Insurrection § 36,
Westlaw (database updated August 2023) (“Insurrection is distinguished from
rout, riot, and offenses connected with mob violence by the fact that, in
insurrection, there is an organized and armed uprising against authority or
operations of government, while crimes growing out of mob violence, however
serious they may be and however numerous the participants, are simply unlawful
acts in disturbance of the peace which do not threaten the stability of the
government or the existence of political society.”
). But we part company with him
when he goes one step further. No authority supports the position taken by
President Trump’s counsel at oral argument that insurrectionary conduct must
involve a particular length of time or geographic location.

¶184 Although we acknowledge that these definitions vary and some are
arguably broader than others, for purposes of deciding this case, we need not
adopt a single, all-encompassing definition of the word “insurrection.” Rather, it
suffices for us to conclude that any definition of “insurrection” for purposes of
Section Three would encompass a concerted and public use of force or threat of
force by a group of people to hinder or prevent the U.S. government from taking
the actions necessary to accomplish a peaceful transfer of power in this country.
The required force or threat of force need not involve bloodshed, nor must the
dimensions of the effort be so substantial as to ensure probable success. In re
Charge to Grand Jury, 62 F. 828, 830 (N.D. Ill. 1894). Moreover, although those
involved must act in a concerted way, they need not be highly organized at the
insurrection’s inception. See Home Ins. Co. of N.Y. v. Davila, 212 F.2d 731, 736 (1st
Cir. 1954) (“[A]t its inception an insurrection may be a pretty loosely organized
affair. . . . It may start as a sudden surprise attack upon the civil authorities of a
community with incidental destruction of property by fire or pillage, even before
the military forces of the constituted government have been alerted and mobilized
into action to suppress the insurrection.”
).

¶185 The question thus becomes whether the evidence before the district court
sufficiently established that the events of January 6 constituted a concerted and
public use of force or threat of force by a group of people to hinder or prevent the
U.S. government from taking the actions necessary to accomplish the peaceful
transfer of power in this country. We have little difficulty concluding that
substantial evidence in the record supported each of these elements and that, as
the district court found, the events of January 6 constituted an insurrection.

¶186 It is undisputed that a large group of people forcibly entered the Capitol and
that this action was so formidable that the law enforcement officers onsite could
not control it. Moreover, contrary to President Trump’s assertion that no evidence

in the record showed that the mob was armed with deadly weapons or that it
attacked law enforcement officers in a manner consistent with a violent
insurrection, the district court found—and millions of people saw on live
television, recordings of which were introduced into evidence in this case—that
the mob was armed with a wide array of weapons. See Anderson, ¶ 155. The court
also found that many in the mob stole objects from the Capitol’s premises or from
law enforcement officers to use as weapons, including metal bars from the police
barricades and officers’ batons and riot shields and that throughout the day, the
mob repeatedly and violently assaulted police officers who were trying to defend
the Capitol. Id. at ¶¶ 156–57. The fact that actual and threatened force was used
that day cannot reasonably be denied.

¶187 Substantial evidence in the record further established that this use of force
was concerted and public. As the district court found, with ample record support,
“The mob was coordinated and demonstrated a unity of purpose . . . . They
marched through the [Capitol] building chanting in a manner that made clear they
were seeking to inflict violence against members of Congress and Vice President
Pence.” Id. at ¶ 243. And upon breaching the Capitol, the mob immediately
pursued its intended target—the certification of the presidential election—and
reached the House and Senate chambers within minutes of entering the building.
Id. at ¶ 153.

¶188 Finally, substantial evidence in the record showed that the mob’s unified
purpose was to hinder or prevent Congress from counting the electoral votes as
required by the Twelfth Amendment and from certifying the 2020 presidential
election; that is, to preclude Congress from taking the actions necessary to
accomplish a peaceful transfer of power. As noted above, soon after breaching the
Capitol, the mob reached the House and Senate chambers, where the certification
process was ongoing. Id. This breach caused both the House and the Senate to
adjourn, halting the electoral certification process. In addition, much of the mob’s
ire—which included threats of physical violence—was directed at Vice President
Pence, who, in his role as President of the Senate, was constitutionally tasked with
carrying out the electoral count. Id. at ¶¶ 163, 179–80; see U.S. Const. art. I, § 3,
cl. 4; id. at art. II, § 1, cl. 3. As discussed more fully below, these actions were the
product of President Trump’s conduct in singling out Vice President Pence for
refusing President Trump’s demand that the Vice President decline to carry out
his constitutional duties. Anderson, ¶¶ 148, 170, 172–73.

¶189 In short, the record amply established that the events of January 6
constituted a concerted and public use of force or threat of force by a group of
people to hinder or prevent the U.S. government from taking the actions necessary
to accomplish the peaceful transfer of power in this country. Under any viable
definition, this constituted an insurrection, and thus we will proceed to consider
whether President Trump “engaged in” this insurrection.




https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/Supreme_Court/Opinions/2023/23SA300.pdf
ZRX1200 Offline
#39 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
Attack…..with?

All those guns that had?
RayR Offline
#40 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 8,927
Ok, I'm tired of the legal weasel talk about what is an '"insurrection".

How about some more PEDO JOE?

See if you can make sense out of this.
Oh! and the handpicked audience of clapping seals is back.

Some pandering to the Jewish community about the White House needing a permanent menorah instead of the one they got now made out of used scrap wood.
He says he's a Zionist.
He says that blowhard Chucky Schumer is his buddy.
He says the holocaust was 65 years ago. NO JOKE MAN! It was in 1958? Who knew?
Some boring story about his daddy and wanting to take his grandchildren to a concentration camp and slurred ramblings about other stuff.

JOE BIDEN DISGRACED HIMSELF ON STAGE! I'm ashamed TO WATCH THIS!

https://youtu.be/xqiSRaiPgL0?si=9msChbLsW5pU5Tcg
DrafterX Offline
#41 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,560
Ya... Biden sucks... Mellow
Abrignac Offline
#42 Posted:
Joined: 02-24-2012
Posts: 17,327
rfenst wrote:
.
https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/Supreme_Court/Opinions/2023/23SA300.pdf


I’ve been giving this some thought. I can’t file it under the Truck Stop Toilet Stall Think Tank because I’m waiting to get my trailer unloaded instead of my colon.

But, is it possible that parts of the US Constitution could be un-Constitutional? Stand by because I think things could get complicated.

What happened on Jan has been described as an insurrection. Not here to debate the validity of such a claim because I suspect at least one case of those convicted of such as it relates to Jan 6 will make its way to the SCOTUS who will then have to define an insurrection in narrow enough terms such that it’s definition doesn’t infringe upon 1st Amendment freedoms so they can then form an opinion to be issued. I say this because as I understand it there is little if any case law regarding an insurrection.

Moving forward from that point the SCOTUS will remand the proceedings back to the lower courts to issue a ruling consistent with its findings to determine if those specific individuals were themselves peacefully protesting, doesn’t matter what others were doing only what those convicted were themselves were a party to, or if they were exercising their rights under the 1st Amendment. Should it be determined that they were peacefully protesting, again not what others were doing, then was that protected speech?

1st Amendment to the Constitution wrote:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.


Getting back to the part about parts of the Constitution being un-constitutional.

14th Amendment to the Constitution; Section 3 wrote:
Disqualification from Holding Office
No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.


If you go back and look at Robert’s post he included a huge a bit of language regarding stages of an insurrection. But, it has to be conceived before it can be born. In this case, conception would come in the form of speech at a gathering of one or more people. So where does one draw the line demarking the perfectly legal freedom under the 1st Amendment to peaceful gather and plan how to seek redress of grievances and cross over into leading an insurrection which would theoretically preclude someone who has taken a specific oath from continuing or subsequently holding an elected office?
ZRX1200 Offline
#43 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
It’s just depends on how they’re registered and if they’re being steered by FBI plants.
rfenst Offline
#44 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,360
Abrignac wrote:
So where does one draw the line demarking the perfectly legal freedom under the 1st Amendment to peaceful gather and plan how to seek redress of grievances and cross over into leading an insurrection which would theoretically preclude someone who has taken a specific oath from continuing or subsequently holding an elected office?

IMO, the "line is crossed" with illegal speech (incitement for example) and for anyone who knew they were crossing or usurping a police line- which invalidates the Freedom of Speech issue because it is a criminal act.
ZRX1200 Offline
#45 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
And if that was entrapped?
8trackdisco Offline
#46 Posted:
Joined: 11-06-2004
Posts: 60,090
After some further contemplation I’ve decided the plants were probably the problem.

A handful of feds telling slack jawed, dimwitted, drooling mouth breathers to charge forward could easily happen.

Some people are just easily led and simple. They can’t be expected to think critically about their leader. They know they don’t really know what to do so they cling onto a strongman and go all the way down with him. Because without his strongman, he realizes he is now nothing.
Abrignac Offline
#47 Posted:
Joined: 02-24-2012
Posts: 17,327
ZRX1200 wrote:
And if that was entrapped?


In the instant case, it's hard to claim entrapment when one is standing at a podium beating his gums.
ZRX1200 Offline
#48 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
8 a guy who wasn’t there gets 20 years and the only guy on camera saying “Storm the Capital” gets nothing?

You really think this passes the smell test?

Abrignac the LARPer at the podium did less damage to this country than anyone who normally occupies that podium in the last 30 years.
Abrignac Offline
#49 Posted:
Joined: 02-24-2012
Posts: 17,327
Gonz
ZRX1200 wrote:
8 a guy who wasn’t there gets 20 years and the only guy on camera saying “Storm the Capital” gets nothing?

You really think this passes the smell test?

Abrignac the LARPer at the podium did less damage to this country than anyone who normally occupies that podium in the last 30 years.


Whether I agree or not is debatable. Either way, immunity is a different subject entirely.

However, his conduct without a doubt was absolutely below the dignity of what should be expected of someone who occupies that office. He squandered an opportunity to do truly positive things because he acted more like a petulant child and less like the President of the United States.

Edit: Don’t forget the fact that I’m far from a left wing zealot. I voted for that deek twice.
8trackdisco Offline
#50 Posted:
Joined: 11-06-2004
Posts: 60,090
ZRX1200 wrote:
8 a guy who wasn’t there gets 20 years and the only guy on camera saying “Storm the Capital” gets nothing?

You really think this passes the smell test?

Abrignac the LARPer at the podium did less damage to this country than anyone who normally occupies that podium in the last 30 years.


Z,
I hear what you are saying. I do. Coming from it from a Systems View, applying the Five Whys, which helps get to the source of the problem and not looking to judge one output against another. It helps gets the Feels out of the equation.

1- Why are these people being prosecuted?
Because of their unlawful actions inside and around the capitol.
Why?
2- Because they were all fired up feeling like 1770’s American Patriots.
Why?
3- Marching on the capitol in protest a contested election.
Why?
4- Because their leader told them to March on the capitol and he’d be there too.
Why?
5- Because he knew he could. Because some (not all) Trump supporters see him as their idol. He has wild eyed, easily influenced and led people looking at him as their idol.

Idolatry, worshiping golden calves has evolved in this century. Instead of God, the extremists, whether they pray to Division, Exclusion, and Inequity or to Trump as their savior are idol worshipers.

He’s got angry, poor, and people not on the better half of the education scale guys by the balls, while he can grab the ladies by the pus zzy.

You shall have no other gods before me. That is where my chips are.
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