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Last post 13 years ago by deadeyedick. 26 replies replies.
Eliminate 'Birthright Citizenship'!!!
DrafterX Offline
#1 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,645
Oklahoma Senate Panel Pushes Forward Bill Eliminating 'Birthright Citizenship'

Published February 16, 2011

OKLAHOMA CITY -- A Senate committee on Tuesday easily approved a pair of Republican-sponsored bills designed to crack down on illegal immigration, despite concerns from Democrats that the bills were an example of "mean-spirited" political pandering.

The Senate Judiciary Committee approved both measures on party-line votes. One would deny Oklahoma citizenship to babies born to illegal immigrants, while the other, dubbed "Arizona-plus" by its author, would allow police to not only question people about their immigration status, but also to confiscate property — including homes and vehicles — belonging to those in the country illegally.

Both measures now advance to the Senate Appropriations Committee.

Republican Sen. Ralph Shortey, who wrote the immigration bills and represents a heavily Hispanic district in south Oklahoma City, said he disagrees with the current interpretation of the 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution that babies born in this country automatically become American citizens. He said his bill on asset forfeiture would give law enforcement an incentive to capture and jail illegal immigrants.

"Legal Hispanics in my district are very supportive of these laws," Shortey said. "Illegal Hispanics are not, and to be quite honest, I really don't care what they think."

Shortey's bill includes language similar to an Arizona law that allows police conducting traffic stops or questioning people about other possible legal violations to ask them about their immigration status if there is reasonable suspicion that they're in the country illegally.

Arizona's law ignited protests over whether it would lead to racial profiling, and prompted lawsuits by the Justice Department, civil rights groups and other opponents seeking to have it thrown out. A federal judge has ordered some of the Arizona law placed on hold.

The Oklahoma bill would go a step further by allowing police to confiscate vehicles or property used to transport or house illegal immigrants, Shortey said. The money from the sale of such property would help pay to incarcerate the illegal immigrants in county jails and for their prosecution.

"We're one-upping the Arizona legislation. We're making it better," Shortey said. "If you give (law enforcement) a fiscal reason why they should do it, then they're going to enforce these laws."

Sen. Judy Eason-McIntyre, D-Tulsa, described both measures as a "mean-spirited" political ploy to distract voters from more important issues, such as the state budget and Oklahoma's economy. She voiced concern that such a law encourages discrimination against both illegal immigrants and Hispanic Americans.

"I gave the example of Nazi Germany," Eason-McIntyre said after the meeting. "You start defining people, saying who's worthy and who's not worthy, and it leads to a lot of negative things directed at people who are very vulnerable.

"It becomes easier to mistreat people when they become, in your mind, sub-humans."

Nationwide, state lawmakers introduced more than 1,400 bills and resolutions related to immigrants or immigration in 2010, including six states in which bills similar to Arizona's were introduced, according to the National Conference on State Legislatures.

None of the Arizona-style bills was enacted.

Targeting birthright citizenship appears to be the latest pet project of anti-illegal immigrant lawmakers across the country, said Michele Waslin, a policy analyst for the Washington, D.C.-based Immigration Policy Center.

"It's kind of an idea that's always been around with the extreme anti-immigrant folks," Waslin said. "This year it seems to be more popular as more people try to be tough on illegal immigration."

Waslin said Oklahoma risks expensive court costs trying to defend such laws and being alienated by businesses and industry who view such measures as extreme.

"Arizona has lost millions of dollars from people who have boycotted tourism there and withdrew conferences," she said. "If police are going to be arresting people for their immigration violations, that means an increase costs to detain and prosecute these people."

Film at 11.... Mellow
ZRX1200 Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,733
Anchor baby outrage!!
HockeyDad Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,272
Is there such a thing as "Oklahoma citizenship"?
fiddler898 Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 06-15-2009
Posts: 3,782
I understand the illegals are just streaming into Oklahoma to have their babies... look, there goes another one!!!
teedubbya Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Is it still ok in OK to marry your sister? Assuming it is, I sure hope the babies are still considered citizens.
DrafterX Offline
#6 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,645
teedubbya wrote:
Is it still ok in OK to marry your sister? Assuming it is, I sure hope the babies are still considered citizens.



I believe you are thinking about Arkansas... or maybe Kentucky.... and I think they are called Bassards... Mellow
but I could be wrong... Think
Papachristou Offline
#7 Posted:
Joined: 10-20-2010
Posts: 845
although im not well versed on the subject, i dont think most countries grant citizenship to you just because you are born there. If both your parents are french and your mom happens to give birth in Greece, you are still a french citizen. it makes sense. if i was traveling with my wife, and she went into labor overseas, i would expect my child to be a US citizen, not whatever country the baby happened to be born in.

i doubt arizona lost millions of dollars in tourism. its funny though, mexicos immigration laws are 10x more strict and racist than ours. and strangly worse than arizonas new laws.

Article 67 of Mexico's immigration law requires that all authorities "whether federal, local or municipal" demand to see visas if approached by a foreigner and to hand over migrants to immigration authorities.

immigrants cant own certain prime property

illegal immgration is a felony under mexican law




america needs to start sticking up for itself and stop worrying about offending people.

DrMaddVibe Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,735
Papachristou wrote:
america needs to start sticking up for itself and stop worrying about offending people.




What do we want?



LANDMINES, PREDATOR DRONES & GUN TURRETS

When do we want it?



NOW!!!
DadZilla3 Offline
#9 Posted:
Joined: 01-17-2009
Posts: 4,633
Maginot Line Outrage!
fiddler898 Offline
#10 Posted:
Joined: 06-15-2009
Posts: 3,782
Does "America sticking up for itself" include an occasional glance at the Bill of Rights?
wheelrite Offline
#11 Posted:
Joined: 11-01-2006
Posts: 50,119
Anchor babies are needed..

One day Pedro will be too old to mow my lawn...
HockeyDad Offline
#12 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,272
I believe the first line item in the Illegal Alien Bill of Rights is:

Thus shall try not to get caught.
DrafterX Offline
#13 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,645
HockeyDad wrote:
I believe the first line item in the Illegal Alien Bill of Rights is:

Thus shall try not to get caught.



who is Thus..?? Huh
Papachristou Offline
#14 Posted:
Joined: 10-20-2010
Posts: 845
the Bill of Rights has to be for Citizens. We cannot afford to continue to feed, clothe, house and treat other countries citizens. sure gov healthcare works in canada. Their obesity rate is substantially less than ours and they have far less people dependant on the system (those who dont contribute) we are raising generations of children who are not taught to work hard to succeed but rather we are instilling an entitlement mentality in them where its the governments job for everything. the harsh reality is medical treatments cost money.
Stinkdyr Offline
#15 Posted:
Joined: 06-16-2009
Posts: 9,948
^^ tru dat. End welfare breeding.
daveincincy Offline
#16 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2006
Posts: 20,033
Papachristou wrote:
although im not well versed on the subject, i dont think most countries grant citizenship to you just because you are born there. If both your parents are french and your mom happens to give birth in Greece, you are still a french citizen. it makes sense. if i was traveling with my wife, and she went into labor overseas, i would expect my child to be a US citizen, not whatever country the baby happened to be born in.


Actually, I think that IS the case. Someone born in the US, regardless of whether or not their parent(s) are US citizens, would be considered a US citizen. That's kind of the attraction of it all. And if you are travelling abroad, and your wife gives birth, your child could choose to be a citizen of that country. Somebody feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. If I recall correctly, our neighbors lived in Canada for a while. The husband was transferred there on assignment with his company. They kept their house here becuase they knew it would only last about 2 years. Anyway, they had a child while living in Canada, and I think their son, technically, is not a US citizen...I could be totally wrong and dreaming that up...I dunno. But I seem to remember hearing something like that. I seem to remember another family I know who lived in Germany for a while and had a child over there that dealt with the same thing. Think
rfenst Offline
#17 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,608
fiddler898 wrote:
Does "America sticking up for itself" include an occasional glance at the Bill of Rights?



Only when doing so supports one's position.
Papachristou Offline
#18 Posted:
Joined: 10-20-2010
Posts: 845
daveincincy wrote:
Actually, I think that IS the case. Someone born in the US, regardless of whether or not their parent(s) are US citizens, would be considered a US citizen. That's kind of the attraction of it all. And if you are travelling abroad, and your wife gives birth, your child could choose to be a citizen of that country. Somebody feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. If I recall correctly, our neighbors lived in Canada for a while. The husband was transferred there on assignment with his company. They kept their house here becuase they knew it would only last about 2 years. Anyway, they had a child while living in Canada, and I think their son, technically, is not a US citizen...I could be totally wrong and dreaming that up...I dunno. But I seem to remember hearing something like that. I seem to remember another family I know who lived in Germany for a while and had a child over there that dealt with the same thing. Think



im no expert but i believe the parents beung US citizens entitle their child to US citizenship. when you actually love and care about your country, you retain this citizenship for your child. when you are fleeing your country and living in the US illegally, you want your child to have US citizenship so you can have an anchor here.
Lumpa Offline
#19 Posted:
Joined: 03-04-2009
Posts: 377
Any baby born on US soil should be a citizen.
This does not give any rights whatsoever to anybody else.
If parents aren't legally entitled to be here, then why should citizenship of their child change that?
Hospitals that seek to offer obstetrics to foreigners should be heavily regulated and taxed.

If baby can grow up to be productive enough to create American jobs, then baby can fill those jobs them with whomever baby chooses, subject to immigration paperwork being done.
daveincincy Offline
#20 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2006
Posts: 20,033
Lumpa wrote:
Any baby born on US soil should be a citizen.

Ummm....NO.

Lumpa wrote:
This does not give any rights whatsoever to anybody else.
If parents aren't legally entitled to be here, then why should citizenship of their child change that?


Well, then why offer citizenship to any baby born on US soil if the parents are not citizens? And if any child born on US soil can become a citizen, I agree, it should not give any rights to anybody else (i.e. non-citizen parents). But if a child born on US soil can become a citizen simply by being born here, what do you do with the parent(s)? Does the doc say, "the kid can stay, but you gots to go."
delarob Offline
#21 Posted:
Joined: 06-28-2001
Posts: 5,318
Ya know, I thnk everyone agrees that anyone can come here, just do it the right way. If that way is slow, find ways to speed it up. If you can't do that then why should we just grant immunity just because you can run across the border.

It amounts to theft of services.
deadeyedick Offline
#22 Posted:
Joined: 03-13-2003
Posts: 17,222
The USA is unique in conferring birthright citizenship on the US-born children of illegal immigrants. The 14th Amendment was never written or intended to be used in this way but was written to confer citizenship on former slaves not immigrants.

It has been interpeted by the courts to become immigration policy instead of citizenship policy.

Our immigration policies have allowed millions of immigrants to gain citizenship just because they are related to a citizen.

DED
DrafterX Offline
#23 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,645
deadeyedick wrote:
The USA is unique in conferring birthright citizenship on the US-born children of illegal immigrants. The 14th Amendment was never written or intended to be used in this way but was written to confer citizenship on former slaves not immigrants.

It has been interpeted by the courts to become immigration policy instead of citizenship policy.

Our immigration policies have allowed millions of immigrants to gain citizenship just because they are related to a citizen.

DED



Think I haven't heard that....
DrMaddVibe Offline
#24 Posted:
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,735
Was CROS deported?horse
Lumpa Offline
#25 Posted:
Joined: 03-04-2009
Posts: 377
Lumpa wrote:
Any baby born on US soil should be a citizen.


daveincincy wrote:
Ummm....NO.

So you are saying the constitution has it wrong?
Hmm. The old document seems to have served pretty well so far, and it seems odd it would break down on such a simple issue. The framers had European backgrounds - the concept of "our country is full" would probably not have been inconceivable to them.

This absoposilutely would require a constitutional amendment to change, and anyways, IMHO the American Way is to not turn our backs on those who originated here.

Lumpa wrote:

This does not give any rights whatsoever to anybody else.
If parents aren't legally entitled to be here, then why should citizenship of their child change that?
Hospitals that seek to offer obstetrics to foreigners should be heavily regulated and taxed.

If baby can grow up to be productive enough to create American jobs, then baby can fill those jobs them with whomever baby chooses, subject to immigration paperwork being done.


daveincincy wrote:
Well, then why offer citizenship to any baby born on US soil if the parents are not citizens? And if any child born on US soil can become a citizen, I agree, it should not give any rights to anybody else (i.e. non-citizen parents). But if a child born on US soil can become a citizen simply by being born here, what do you do with the parent(s)? Does the doc say, "the kid can stay, but you gots to go."

Precisely.
Well, preferably it would be the police saying that,

If they can arrange for the baby to stay, OK.
If the kid leaves, but can get back, fine.
But the parents don't get a free ride.
deadeyedick Offline
#26 Posted:
Joined: 03-13-2003
Posts: 17,222
"But the parents don't get a free ride."

Unfortunately that is not true with our current system. The immediate family of a citizen has a large preference in the green card lottery.

DED
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