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Last post 7 years ago by TMCTLT. 38 replies replies.
President pushes ObamaCare despite double-digit rate hikes
Burner02 Offline
#1 Posted:
Joined: 12-21-2010
Posts: 12,884
Despite rate and deductible increases, President Obama on Thursday defended his namesake health care program and said millions of Americans “now know the financial security of health insurance” because of the Affordable Care Act.

His remarks came as ObamaCare sticker shock is getting even worse in some parts of the country, as more and more states are approving soaring rate increases for next year- with one Arizona town seeing a 75 percent hike and another in Minnesota seeing a 190 percent increase in deductibles over the course of four years.

“It’s absolutely unaffordable,” Minnesota Republican House Speaker Kurt Daudt told FoxNews.com. “I don’t even consider that health coverage.”

With some families forced to shell out $2,000 a month for insurance that comes with a whopping $13,000 deductible, Daudt said for some the only option is to pull their coverage and pay a fee for not having insurance, which in 2016 came out to $695 per adult and $347.50 per child (up to a maximum of $2085.)

“It’s catastrophic,” Daudt said, adding that he’s talked to Minnesotans who are being forced to financially drop their coverage, pay the fine and save money on the side for medical emergencies.

However Obama, speaking in Miami, maintained “It’s worked,” but admitted the program wasn't perfect. “No law is.”

Obama was in south Florida to trump up support for the ACA before the Nov. 1 start of the enrollment period.

Problems with rising premiums in many parts of the country as well as major insurers calling it quits have left consumers with few or in some cases no choices next year.

The hikes are fueling criticism of the law, though the White House is now openly pushing the possibility of a public option.

The troubles have bolstered arguments of Republicans and added some top Democratic allies to the crowd of critics, including former President Bill Clinton, who called ObamaCare “the craziest thing in the world,” while Minnesota Gov. Mark Dayton said it’s “no longer affordable.”

In Arizona, after months of health insurer exits from the Affordable Care Act marketplace, state regulators have approved plans from two companies that will be the only marketplace insurance providers in 2017.

Maricopa County residents' only health care option will be Centene Corp., which said it will sell its “Ambetter” plans at a 74.5 percent increase next year.

The amount people pay will vary on their age, coverage levels and income, which in turn will determine whether an individual qualifies for subsidies that help offset the cost of monthy premiums. Nearly 70 percent of Arizonans with a marketplace plan get subsidized coverage.

Jumps in finalized rates for big health insurance plans around the country illustrate the challenge the Obama administration faces as it seeks to stabilize the president’s landmark health care legislation before he leaves office.

According to a roundup by The Wall Street Journal, market leaders continuing to sell coverage through HealthCare.gov or a state equivalent are seeking premium increases of 30 percent of more in Delaware, Hawaii, Alabama, Mississippi, Kansas and Texas.

In Montana, Oklahoma, Tennessee and Pennsylvania, the approved rate increases for the market leader top 50 percent.

Blue Cross Blue Shield in New Mexico agreed to start selling plans through the online exchanges after pulling out last year. They agreed to return to the state only if they would be allowed to increase rates 93 percent of their 2015 level.





danmdevries Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 02-11-2014
Posts: 17,359
Premiums in the private market have increased significantly due to the increased regulations of the ACA as well. About 30% of my paycheck goes to medical insurance for the family. I'm going to be moving into a high deductible plan during open enrollment this year because I can't afford to be paying a third of my income to insurance that doesn't pay much of my bills. Had a brief ER visit a few weeks ago, had been ill with vomiting/diarrhea and was pretty dehydrated when I went to work. Nearly passed out after vomiting again so my coworkers wheeled me to ER instead of just letting me be and the only treatment I received was 3 glasses of water. I refused everything else except lab work and EKG. $3500.... Due diligence I made a followup appointment with family doc, which was another $!60. Now, after insurance adjustment the ER was 1500ish and office visit 90. Insurance paid 600 of the ER visit and 30 of the office visit. I pay a hair under a thousand a month for insurance. I could have paid for that stuff out of pocket at full price and still ended up significantly ahead for the year.
danmdevries Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 02-11-2014
Posts: 17,359
And costs aside, the ACA has been detrimental to patient outcomes.

A big variable for hospital reimbursement is now patient satisfaction. Hospitals are paid based on how happy the patients were with their stay. Not with the outcomes of whatever happened to them, but with their stay in the hospital. Don't get the drug seekers high, cutting your payments. Don't give the diabetic regular Pepsi, cutting your payments. This has fallen on my shoulders quite considerably as my job performance is now evaluated not by my patients' outcome, but by how happy they and their families are with their stay. So, I've adopted a new MO. "Think of the Press Gainey's" Stroke patient wants water but failed their swallow evaluation and family's pissed off - oops, I accidentally gave the family a glass of water. Unfortunately "I didn't notice" them give it to the patient, and now the patient has aspirated and wound up with pneumonia and on a ventilator. But, they'd be even more pissed off if I didn't give them the water. Extreme case, and absolutely not something I would do, but very much plausible.

Higher patient satisfaction scores have many times over been correlated to higher morbidity and mortality.
ZRX1200 Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,589
On my end all insurance reimbursement is down significantly. We've laid off hundreds and it's going to get worse, it's past skeleton and I don't have much confidence in it getting better.

It was designed to fail. I was the first one here to say that and I maintain that statement. It was a gateways to single payer. You have to make enough people want something and that's what's going on.

Barry says that the ACA isn't the cause, that premiums would be even higher with the old system. And for him he's lucky to not be able to quantify that, as my dad would say "you talk like a kid with a paper azzwhole".
Gene363 Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 01-24-2003
Posts: 30,810
Our sons and one of daughter in law have medical coverage with significantly higher premiums and astonishingly high out of pocket limitations. Ironically, my medicare coverage is looking almost as good as what current employees are being offered. They pay for things like abortion and birth coverage though they are not able to have any more children, it's not insurance, it's a tax.

ram27bat
frankj1 Offline
#6 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
Thanks Mitt!



HA!
MACS Offline
#7 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,770
In an effort to not have some families go broke due to a catastrophic illness... Obamacare is making more people suffer financial loss paying premiums and deductibles.

It's a failure. Lets please just admit it, repeal it, and move on.
cacman Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 07-03-2010
Posts: 12,216
Burner02 wrote:
With some families forced to shell out $2,000 a month for insurance that comes with a whopping $13,000 deductible, Daudt said for some the only option is to pull their coverage and pay a fee for not having insurance, which in 2016 came out to $695 per adult and $347.50 per child (up to a maximum of $2085.)

Cheaper to pay the tax (not fee) for not having insurance. I refuse to buy into the Obamacare scheme.
gummy jones Offline
#9 Posted:
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
so it begins - endless spin and deflection

"it is actually much less of a hike than it would be without obamacare"
-one of the talking heads today

the saddest part is that there is a portion of the country who will believe the above statement
ZRX1200 Offline
#10 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,589
Frank, did you vote for him ever?

I didn't
victor809 Offline
#11 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Gummy.... How do you know the talking head is wrong?

I don't like Obama care... I didn't like the idea when Hillary was pushing for it. But I also know that I don't know enough about how these systems work to know whether the increase would have been more or less without obamacare...

Are you a health care systems analyst? You seem very certain.
zitotczito Offline
#12 Posted:
Joined: 08-21-2006
Posts: 6,441
Relax, a majority of the American voter's showed their ignorance and in some cases pure stupidity which got us Obama and ObamaCare. I hope everyone enjoys the premium increases. Now I have total faith that the American voter will come through and elect Hillary and maybe HillaryCare(single payer). Enjoy that when it comes.
frankj1 Offline
#13 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
ZRX1200 wrote:
Frank, did you vote for him ever?

I didn't

nope, not when he was a one and done gov in MA either.
I did vote for Baker, the current gov here who is also a republican.
Mr. Jones Offline
#14 Posted:
Joined: 06-12-2005
Posts: 19,421
Make less than $13,500
And go on MEDICAID...

IT'S THE BOMB...

ZERO PREMIUM
ZERO DR. CO-PAY
ZERO SPECIALIST CO-PAY
ZERO PRESCRIPTION CO-PAY
ONE DOLLAR ($1.00) EMERGENCY ROOM CO-PAY

MY HEALTHCARE IS AS GOOD OR BETTER
THAN ANY OF YOU BOTL's...PROLLY THE
SAME AS A STATE SENATOR OR CONGRESSMAN

All thanks to the FBI & their COWARD SSG DIVISION FELON CRIMINAL ****-up's...

GIVE ME BACK MY $ MILLION $ bucks THAT YOU STOLE
and I'll rejoin "the heathcare payer system"
gummy jones Offline
#15 Posted:
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
Mr. Jones wrote:
Make less than $13,500
And go on MEDICAID...

IT'S THE BOMB...

ZERO PREMIUM
ZERO DR. CO-PAY
ZERO SPECIALIST CO-PAY
ZERO PRESCRIPTION CO-PAY
ONE DOLLAR ($1.00) EMERGENCY ROOM CO-PAY

MY HEALTHCARE IS AS GOOD OR BETTER
THAN ANY OF YOU BOTL's...


i agree
i want to jump in and take a ride
im sick of pulling the wagon

AZCigarguy Offline
#16 Posted:
Joined: 04-29-2015
Posts: 24
zitotczito wrote:
Relax, a majority of the American voter's showed their ignorance and in some cases pure stupidity which got us Obama and ObamaCare. I hope everyone enjoys the premium increases. Now I have total faith that the American voter will come through and elect Hillary and maybe HillaryCare(single payer). Enjoy that when it comes.


Yep, all the dopes in the country not only elected this guy once but twice and our lovely Rhino friends gave him whatever he wanted and more. Now we are faced with 8 years of Hillary and then probably 8 of Michelle O since she is now going to be a Senator soon then so on so on. Rep party is a joke, they implode at first stress test and run to cover their own behinds. Meanwhile they left Trump hi and dry with zero support and basically voted in Hillary, say what you want running for cover is a vote for her, period. Anyway, we can thank the media for now being an arm of the DNC and we get screwed, kiss the middle class goodbye and more restrictions on your guns and rights, oh and enjoy the new days of flag burning and teaching our kids to disrespect our country and call it bad.

Cheers to America, the country its people walked over in the name of political correctness.


ram27bat

Mr. Jones Offline
#17 Posted:
Joined: 06-12-2005
Posts: 19,421
Please tell me ....
That the above mentioned "M.O" ^^^^
Only wants to be a SENATOR...
THAT I COULD HANDLE, NO PROBLEM...

BUT NOT ANOTHER "TAG TEAM"
Husband and wife presidential duo...
tonygraz Offline
#18 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,243
Mr. Jones wrote:
Make less than $13,500
And go on MEDICAID...

IT'S THE BOMB...

ZERO PREMIUM
ZERO DR. CO-PAY
ZERO SPECIALIST CO-PAY
ZERO PRESCRIPTION CO-PAY
ONE DOLLAR ($1.00) EMERGENCY ROOM CO-PAY

MY HEALTHCARE IS AS GOOD OR BETTER
THAN ANY OF YOU BOTL's...PROLLY THE
SAME AS A STATE SENATOR OR CONGRESSMAN

All thanks to the FBI & their COWARD SSG DIVISION FELON CRIMINAL ****-up's...

GIVE ME BACK MY $ MILLION $ bucks THAT YOU STOLE
and I'll rejoin "the heathcare payer system"



But then there are those signs in the doctors offices that say "We do not take Medicaid patients". And there are a lot of them.
Mr. Jones Offline
#19 Posted:
Joined: 06-12-2005
Posts: 19,421
^^^ Not in urban areas ...so MUCH...

But there are a few...
I just don't go there...

Maybe in the boonies? there are a lot of them?

There would be riots if that was the case
In urban areas.
ZRX1200 Offline
#20 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,589
Medicaid is a joke.

The $ goes to administration just like most gov programs. In many instances they want to pay less than something costs, not including the costs surrounding providing said care.....

Here in Oregon there's Medicaid and a few managed care plans under Medicaid. The contract for the managed plans happened to go to one of our competitors. The competitors regional manager happens to be married to the "lady" who ran the contracts for Medicaid. This was supposed to be an exclusive contract, common practice in our industry for insurance to leverage pricing for their and customer benefits. This ended up going to two companies SOLELY because of her relationship to the one companies regional manager.

I had a conversation years back with a OHP (Medicaid) rep wanting to renegotiate a contract. We had recently been bought out, explained that we no longer handle that locally we now had a legal dept handling such matters. She kept talking, and insisted that the most that they could pay for that service was $_____. Well I explained that $____ was 10% less than the cost of that item and good luck.

Oh.....they also lie. We started making them send auth's in WRITING due to them saying the verbal auths (WITH AUTH NUMBERES) never happened. They threw a tissy about that because the hospitals started chewing them out....

But by all means, go beurocracy.
Stinkdyr Offline
#21 Posted:
Joined: 06-16-2009
Posts: 9,948
Obama calls this......WINNING!

Brick wall
DrafterX Offline
#22 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,548
And people will believe him.. Mellow
teedubbya Offline
#23 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
ZRX1200 wrote:
Medicaid is a joke.

The $ goes to administration just like most gov programs. In many instances they want to pay less than something costs, not including the costs surrounding providing said care.....

Here in Oregon there's Medicaid and a few managed care plans under Medicaid. The contract for the managed plans happened to go to one of our competitors. The competitors regional manager happens to be married to the "lady" who ran the contracts for Medicaid. This was supposed to be an exclusive contract, common practice in our industry for insurance to leverage pricing for their and customer benefits. This ended up going to two companies SOLELY because of her relationship to the one companies regional manager.

I had a conversation years back with a OHP (Medicaid) rep wanting to renegotiate a contract. We had recently been bought out, explained that we no longer handle that locally we now had a legal dept handling such matters. She kept talking, and insisted that the most that they could pay for that service was $_____. Well I explained that $____ was 10% less than the cost of that item and good luck.

Oh.....they also lie. We started making them send auth's in WRITING due to them saying the verbal auths (WITH AUTH NUMBERES) never happened. They threw a tissy about that because the hospitals started chewing them out....

But by all means, go beurocracy.



Medicaid is an interesting bird and my background is pretty deep in it from 5 states, federal, and provider perspective. It is very different from state to state (including provider payment, attitude, competance, and percentage of federal dollah) with a core that must be met. The pacific northwest in some ways have been innovative (both good and bad) in how they do things.

My general take on Medicaid (and major parts of obammy care but also expanded to insurance companies) is in some ways it's welfare for medical providers and a perfect example of program growth and a life of it's own. It was not intended to fully cover cost let alone make any sort of profit. It's original intent was to off set losses to providers that were providing free care or barter. But once implemented providers now want 100% of cost or preferably profit. In the past many of these people received care for free or not at all. I don't blame providers for not participating given the requirements and hassle etc. But getting paid less than cost doesn't phase me. The issue is the profit centers drying up elsewhere and the governments grab of a greater and greater percentage of the market.

Z I agree with you completely on the general rigamaroll and while not familiar with your states 'caid don't doubt your experience and view one bit.

Medicare is a different bird all together and a whole 'nother conversation.

Just my opinion.
teedubbya Offline
#24 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
By the way Z I'd love to smoke one with you and talk shop. I might just learn something.


And by smoke one I mean cigar and no where near your van.
DrMaddVibe Offline
#25 Posted:
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,412
https://academeblog.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/ceo-salaries-in-health-insurance-industry.jpg

horse
teedubbya Offline
#26 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Health insurance is a nasty industry.
gummy jones Offline
#27 Posted:
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
teedubbya wrote:
It was not intended to fully cover cost let alone make any sort of profit. It's original intent was to off set losses to providers that were providing free care or barter. But once implemented providers now want 100% of cost or preferably profit.


Heaven forbid a practitioner want to be paid fairly for a days work. i would love someone to walk into walmart, take a tv to the register and say that you will pay 25% of what the guy before you paid. just because.

that is medicaid.

and by the way, the population on medicaid is significantly less healthy and significantly more likely to sue their providers. so you are getting paid less to take care of someone who is sicker, someone who will not likely get better because throwing money at them doesnt magically make them accountable to their own health and, in the end, they are more likely to bring forth a lawsuit claiming their poor outcome is their providers fault. meanwhile, the appointment no show rate for folks on medicaid is incredible. who woulda guessed someone wouldnt put much value on something that never cost them anything to begin with...

heck, if anything, providers should make more in treating these folks for taking on more risk.
DrafterX Offline
#28 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,548
gummy jones wrote:
i would love someone to walk into walmart, take a lime water to the register and say that you will pay 25% of what the guy before you paid. just because.




think it's been done... Mellow
ZRX1200 Offline
#29 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,589
Gummy the stories I could tell with medicaid patients......

It's frustrating to see Medicare patients fight for what medicaid patients are given. And at least Medicare patients paid into the system.
dkeage Offline
#30 Posted:
Joined: 03-05-2004
Posts: 15,151
Just got my new BCBS policy for next year............ premiums up 59%!
Brick wall
zitotczito Offline
#31 Posted:
Joined: 08-21-2006
Posts: 6,441
Stop all the whining here. Hillary will get in and you all will have the single payer insurance you want. Piss poor care that you will have to fight to get. Enjoy!

frankj1 Offline
#32 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
thanks Mitt
gummy jones Offline
#33 Posted:
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
zitotczito wrote:
Stop all the whining here. Hillary will get in and you all will have the single payer insurance you want. Piss poor care that you will have to fight to get. Enjoy!



at least it will be "free"


Sarcasm
zitotczito Offline
#34 Posted:
Joined: 08-21-2006
Posts: 6,441
gummy jones wrote:
at least it will be "free"


Sarcasm


LOL
TMCTLT Offline
#35 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
frankj1 wrote:
thanks Mitt



d'oh!
frankj1 Offline
#36 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
TMCTLT wrote:
d'oh!

for real. he started it in MA!
Burner02 Offline
#37 Posted:
Joined: 12-21-2010
Posts: 12,884
frankj1 wrote:
for real. he started it in MA!



Thought Hillary was taking credit.
TMCTLT Offline
#38 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
frankj1 wrote:
for real. he started it in MA!



So...he gets the blame for Obummer hoisting it on the entire nation? interesting Think
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